www.neons.org

Ryan (w103rtm) has written up a very detailed HOW TO convert your automatic to a manual guide.

Hes done an INCREDIBLE job with this, and I have to give him a lot of credit for his hard work.

Check out his guide here:

http://w103rtm.freevar.com/

If you use this guide, or get any useful information from it, please post a thank you in this thread to Ryan for his hard work.

MEGA POST

That covers everything and then some.

A few concerns were brought to my attention about the electrical issues which can be found in the last section on my website.

http://www.w103rtm.freevar.com

The concern was over the brn/yel wire that I specify and the concern was with my electrical configuration that I chose. Keep in mind that I did the ATX to MTX swap but kept the ATX computer (ECU). I never changed computers. I will try and make this more clear in my website and on the video.

The electrical configuration I chose for the MTX swap using the ATX computer was a surprisingly simple and straight forward fix but the configuration is only 100% valid if you are keeping the ATX computer. I discovered this issue via trial and error, when I finished the swap I grounded the brn/yel wire and the car started and ran fine but my cruise control never would activate. I then grounded the brn/yel wire to start the car and then ungrounded it and the car stayed started and my cruise control worked. This is what made me decide to re-route the brn/yel wire into the clutch pedal switch.

I did some revisions to my site.

http://www.w103rtm.freevar.com

I recently purchased an MTX PCM for cheap. It was slightly defective because internally it threw a code 35, therefore, it would not activate the radiator fan, this was confirmed by the individual who I bought it from.

Otherwise, the MTX PCM worked fine and my electrical configuration in no way affected or caused code 35, therefore, I confirmed that my electrical configuration with the BRN/YEL neutral safety switch wire works for both ATX and MTX PCMS in conjunction with cruise control.

I'll soon be adding video on how to bypass code 37 which is the torque converter lockup selenoid. Indeed if you solder a 30 ohm resistor between the wires (or two 15 ohm resistors in series) this will trick the ATX PCM into thinking the torque converter lockup selenoid is still attached to the car and therefore, code 37 will never be tripped.

--Ryan (w103rtm)

Pulling the steering column out makes the pedals a breeze.

You said that to use a 30 ohm resistor, but did not say how many watts it is. I was looking at Radioshack's and they list several 30 ohm resistors with different wattages. Could you clarify, please?

I would recommend a 5 watt power rated 30 ohm resistor, but the radioshack I went to didn't have any and I got a 0.5 watt, which is working just fine. The reason you want a 5 watt is because of this simple formula.

V=IR
we know V = 12 volts (typical automotive battery output)
we know R = 30 ohms (From measuring the resistance of the TCL selenoid)
therefore, I = V/R = 12/30 = 0.4 amps

Power = IV = 0.4*12 = 4.8watts

Ideally a 5 watt resistor would be best, I'm sure I'm running my resistor a little hot so I'll probably go back to radioshack sometime soon to get the appropriate power rated resistor.

The power rating is a maximum allowable rating so if you got a resistor with a rating greater than 5 watts that would work too and would be recommended as well. Usually the higher the power rating the bigger the resistor which is for heat dissipative purposes.

Thank You! I'd had forgotten the formula, greatly appreciated.

Hey no problem! I enjoy the feedback, it helps me make the website better

Just showing you some love, I just finished my atx to mtx swap not even twenty minutes ago and if it wasn't for your how-tos I would still be out there trying to get the thing to start! Only took me a little under ten hours to swap thanks to you!

very nice detailed......although u dont touch on the speedometer. how do u get that to work?

this better get sticked...

This is a new concern with the swap. The speedometer shouldn't have any problems. The speed sensor hookups are the same between an ATX and MTX tranny. The way a ATX and/or MTX PCM handles the voltage output from the sensor is the same. The clusters as well are identical between an ATX and MTX. Some clusters have a tachometer and some don't, however all the cluster's bread boards are capable of handling a tach.

I actually changed clusters a few years ago from the ATX cluster with no tach to the MTX cluster with a tach. This was when I had the ATX tranny, obviously. That swap went smoothly and both the speedometer and tachometer worked in conjuction with my ATX tranny.

I actually still have the ATX cluster, I can swap that back into my car which now has the MTX tranny and see if it works.

Currently my setup is this...
ATX PCM, MTX tranny, MTX cluster (The speedometer and tach work)

These setups worked as well....
MTX PCM, MTX tranny, MTX cluster (The speedometer and tach worked)
ATX PCM, ATX tranny, MTX cluster (The speedometer and tach worked)
ATX PCM, ATX tranny, ATX cluster (The speedometer worked, there was no tach)

I'll try these two alternatives......

ATX PCM, MTX tranny, ATX cluster
MTX PCM, MTX tranny, ATX cluster

Beyond this there are no other alternatives involving the MTX tranny, if my alternatives work then the best advice I can give is to check and make sure the speed sensor isn't malfunctioning or if you got a different cluster, make sure its not malfuncting, sometimes clusters need calibrated.

I had to calibrate my cluster (it wouldn't start registering a speed until I was already going 40 mph), I rolled around in gear at idle in a VACANT parking lot at what is usually about 5 miles and hour (this was when my car was an ATX). I then pulled the needle off of the pin and then put the needle back on at 5 miles an hour and then next thing you know it worked and gave accurate speeds, I did the same with the tach but in idle and not rolling around, I assumed the engine idle speed was roughly 900 rpms, which ended up as a pretty good assumption, pulled the needle and stuck it back on at 900 rpm.

Hey no problem! Thats exactly what I was hoping the website could do for people is allow them to undertake a swap and enjoy it without having to go through as much pain and suffering and second guessing on what you did or didn't do and then worry about what you did or didn't do (I've been there many times and it wastes soooo much darn time). Obviously it still takes a lot of ambition, dedication and hard work, also no two swaps are exactly alike. I figure the website can get you about 95% of the way there and then the rest you can fill in. Great Job!!

Took the Neon out for her maiden voyage and I got everything right but tightening the right front break caliper... Five minutes into the drive I heard two bolts ping off and suddenly heard the caliper scrapping... Perhaps include in your how-to to take our time and tighten every bolt! LMAO!! Otherwise Everything's working great save for the Speedo. When I figure it out I'll pm what I had to do to correct the problem and you can add it in if you like.

At least nothing too horrible happened. As far as tightening what you took off, I'm going to assume that, thats either been done or is going to be done. The procedure is long and wordy enough without having to tell everyone to tighten everything they took off! Like I said the procedure gets you 95% of the way there and tightening bolts falls into the 5%. I do give some torque specs for important nuts and bolts. Remember don't get hasty, its easy to do when you can see the finish line and thats usually when mistakes happen.

As far as the speedometer not working, I'm not sure what that is about . If you figure out something let me know, but I've checked both speedometers with both PCMs and mine have worked fine. Glad to hear the maiden voyage went well! Other than the caliper issue. good luck tweaking.

well what i did was pulled the engine and atx out to rebuild the engine and swap for the five speed. I have had a mtx cluster for a while now and it has worked fine. Had to solder the back of the board but thats normal. I have the atx computer in, but the plug is different from the atx speedo to the mtx on my particular car....i think the mtx came out of a 95....not sure if that plug was different being that year was a stupid year.....

It was'nt that 95 was a stupid year, it was that 96 is when the neons became obd2 compliant. That is when the wiring changed. The 95 neons were obd1 compliant. I believe the 2nd gen. got the NGC modules.

If it helps any the tranny I intalled was off of a '95. I have a '97 MTX cluster and I am using my stock '96 ATX PCM also my '96 ATX cluster worked as well. I've looked in the wiring diagrams to see if there is a link between the cluster and any electrical I had you perform in the online manual and hadn't found anything. It could be one of those internal PCM situations but if that was the case I'm not sure why I didn't have any problems . Good Hunting

the problem is that speed sensor plug is different from early to late years. and the gears are set up a little different. might work but they are different.

i do agree, this is a very good post. theres alot of people who want to do the swap but dont know how. thanks for the good how-to

Hey Im still kinda new on here but I want to do a tranny swap on my 98, its a DOHC, Do you know if its anything I may have to do different from the steps you posted?

Hey! There shouldn't be any problems what-so-ever with the procedure for doing a swap on a DOHC. The title is deceiving "1996 Dodge Neon SOHC: ATX to MTX swap." I just titled it that because that's what my car is. What the title should be is "95-99 Dodge Neon: ATX to MTX swap." If its any consolation the MTX tranny I installed on my car came off of a DOHC Neon, so did the shifter cables and all other components and its worked perfect on my SOHC

It appears there are some issues with the speedometer not working, but this appears to be limited to a select few '95 MTX trannys , but my ATX no-tach cluster and my MTX with a tach cluster both worked after I did the swap.

Your ATX DOHC PCM should work just fine, in fact it should work better because the ATX DOHC PCM doesn't perform as well with the ATX tranny because the ATX shifts at low RPM under low throttle and doesn't take advantage of the DOHC's high rev ability, which is where DOHC's do there best. Good luck and feel free to use this thread to ask questions, there are plenty of very knowledgeable people and myself on this forum that can help. GOOD LUCK, HAVE FUN

Thanks bunches! and thanks for the post, Really helpful!

Just got the pedals done (in 2.5 hours)! it would have taken me all day without your write up.

The brake light switch on the pedal bracket that you (and me too) were worried about breaking can be easily removed, all you have to do is twist it to the left and pull it out. It make getting to all the bolts soo much easier.

Awesome! 2.5 hrs, much better than I did. I had noticed the electrical switch was an easy twist off, once I actually got the bracket out, if I would have known that I wouldn't have had to be so paranoid about breaking it. Things like that will be added to the website, that's why a forum like this as well as people like you who are actually performing the swap will help improve the website overtime.

Look forward to hear how the rest of the swap goes!

okay, i am extremely new to this whole cars and mechanical thing, i am beginning college as a mechanical engineer, so im not so new to the concept of what the parts do, its the terms in which we refer to them, where they are located on my 1996 plymouth neon, and uh, how to tell the difference in what type of engine i have. anyway i was thinking about dropping in a MTX (i think is the right term) into my 1996. the engine was just recently replaced with a newer one that only has 80,000 miles on it, i have yet to add any mods to this engine. the tranny is the same one from 1996 on this car and i wanna know if anyone has a MTX they can sell, or where to get one, i live in the upper michigan and our junkyards are extremely limited here, i also hear alot of negativity about local junk yards anyway. i bought a like new windshield off the yard for 100 dollars and did the removal and installation myself, which was fun. but i hate this cars tranny, it has leaf spring juice shift times. the atx stays in 1st from 0 to 35, which is a little too high for me, then it stays in second all the way up to 65, which again is a little too high of a speed for me to be driving in 2nd gear, especially since i can hear how hard it is working over the wind roaring in my ears, also the speed limit on our highways is 55, so its working real hard at speed limit and i dont want to get pulled over for speeding, for the sake of saving my poor little car the extra work.

so if anyone has any answers to my questions please PM me, i wont be able to find my post again, im not a good forum navigator.

questions:
1, i need a tranny, or a place to buy one in good condition for under 400
2, what do all the terms that relate to the cars engine mean?
3. what kind of engine do i have? how can i tell?
4. why does my car stay in the wrong gear at higher speeds?

After reading the How-to, I am left wondering: was cruise control a factory option for 5-speed cars? If so, wouldn't a same/similar year MTX PCM be a plug-n-play swap for an ATX to MTX swap, and allow you to retain cruise control function without altering the factory wiring?

I didn't see it mentioned, or maybe I missed it, but was the ATX wiring harness retained in the subject vehicle above or was an MTX harness installed? Or are they the same, save for a few unused connection on one or the other?

MTX cars were available with a factory cruise option and every PCM can have cruise. ATX and MTX engine harnesses are the same, but body harnesses are different. If a Neon came from the factory with an MTX, the brown/yellow wire takes a different route and cruise would work. The archived ATX to MTX how to just says to ground the BR/YL wire, but until now, no one had reported this problem. This how to presents a very creative solution that uses the clutch safety switch to ground that wire only when trying to start the engine which is the only time that wire really needs to be grounded.

I see. So if you're doing the ATX-->MTX swap and use a year-appropriate MTX ECM and MTX body harness (provided the car already has cruise control), no re-wiring should be necessary, correct?

After looking at the FSM wiring diagrams, the factory MTX brown/yellow wire is always grounded in the PDC. So the MTX PCM with cruise installed has no problem with the ground always connected. It's the ATX PCM that expects that wire grounded only while starting the engine. I've installed cruise to Neons with original MTX PCMs and ATX swapped to MTX PCMs with no problems so the difference is in the PCM. Keeping the ATX PCM just complicates the ATX to MTX swap.
Swapping the entire body harness isn't really necessary since it's not that hard to make the wiring changes.

Finished the swap this afternoon, it took about 6 hours from start to finish. I didn't hit any major snags along the way, and didn't break any parts (thankfully). I used butt connectors to do the wiring just so I could start it up (I'm soldering and heat shrinking it soon), fired up the first time!

It was very easy thanks to this how to. My total amount invested is right at $500, and that is with quite a few new parts. Pictures can be found in my project log.

Thanks for writing this up w103rtm!

WOW! Thats amazing great job
One question for you did you use the same electrical configuration as I did? Also, did you have any problems with the instrument cluster?
I know a few people who have done the swap using my guide had concerns about the electrical configuration and issues with there instrument cluster not working afterwards. Thanks and 6hrs must be a record!

-Ryan (w103rtm)

White to white, violet to violet, and I grounded the brown/yellow. When I redo the wiring I'm going to run the brown/yellow to the clutch switch so I have to push it in to start the car. Right now I don't have to do that.

No problems with my cluster, my car is a '98 sohc and I'm still using the automatic PCM. I have code 37 for the torque converter but It hasn't affected the drivability.

Thats good to hear, I hadn't had any problems either. If you have cruise control you've probably noticed it doesn't work with that brn/yel being grounded all the time. As for code 37, I'm actually going to put a short video on youtube showing how you can bypass the code. There is a short discussion on this thread that talks about that, it's pretty straight forward.

awsome how to! I have been handed down the family 98 neon Expresso DOHC Auto. my father has had it since new and is in amazing shape. 215K and you would never know it. I always felt the auto really was not a good mach for the neon. I have never been in a 5spd one but it just seems slow for 150HP. I have been thinking of doing the convertion and make the car a lot more fun! I have a 2000 neon ES thats my daily so this would be a good project to try. I just need to try and source all the parts. anyone have any feed back on the difference the convertion made on performance?

Thanks
Jamie

Hey Jamie, well I remember with my auto sohc neon I ran a 17.0 sec. 1/4 mile, back then it had a stock throttle body and UDP (underdrive pulley). That was a few years ago and I forget the speed, I also did not powershift which means the ATX PCM shifted the car at WOT (wide open thottle) below the redline (which on a sohc is 6500). I've been to the track a couple of times with my converted manual sohc neon and my best run was a 15.8 sec. 1/4 mile. at 89mph using the same ATX PCM and it has a 60mm throttle body and UDP, still basically a stock car and I ran to redline before every shift.

Not the most direct comparison, powershifting the automatic could have improved the 17 sec. time, but I would say at most you would gain 1 second (which is an eternity on the strip) on the 1/4 mile with a stick shift as long as you become a proficient shifter and get good launches, I'm not perfect but I do okay at the strip and I ran it to redline 6500rpm every shift. The DOHC and the higher rev limiter will obviously have better numbers but as a relative comparison I think you might gain about 1 sec. That's my 2 cents worth, there are others on this forum that have done a lot more racing than I have and could give you a better idea, alpinegreeneon I believe has worked extensively with ATX and MTX vehicles.

--Ryan (w103rtm)

thanks for the reply, those numbers sound like a good amount to me. I have been thinking i might want to use the car for some auto X events. I would love to do some sort of dirving school with it! I have had the trans out once not that long ago to do the main seal so that part i know. The rest i would follow the how to. any tips pn finding everything needed?

Thanks
Jamie

*a#S!d^f* awesome write up!! I must've read it like 10 times then went an did the swap. took about a week cause parts online didnt come in when i thought they were. The pedal assembly took about 3 hours to take it off and put the other one on. It feels like i barely touch the gas pedal and it revs up fast. Still rocking the ATX PCM for now (takin any donars fo 97 SOHC MTX PCM's ) Still gotta put my panals back together but it runs bad*a#S!d^f*. Thanks for all the help!! Defintally worth the swap

AWESOME!

That was the first thing I noticed after I did the swap, 1st gear on the ATX : 1st gear on the MTX and naturally with 5 gears to play with you can keep it revved up from 5 mph all the way up to 100mph. The ATX was only good for 20 to about 75 and that was about it. Glad it went well!! Despite the parts taking some time to come in.

I'm glad this got attention. I remember seeing it and thinking, why has this not been found yet? Great HowTo.