www.neons.org

Home of the Neon Enthusiast
It is currently Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:28 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: How To: Automatic to Manual Transmission Swap
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2002 12:33 am 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2002 12:28 pm
Posts: 536
Location: Jupiter florida Where old people run you off the road
Tranny swap tipsok some of this is just info i collected from other sources
Transmissions:
3.55 or 3.94 all dohc neons came with a 3.94 but the R/T and ACR neons have a different final drive and 5th gear i think the first sohc ACR's had the same 5th and final as well

the 3.94 seems to be the best choice for the all motor or lower power cars because of the gearing

the 3.55 seems to be the best for the high power or turbo guys

check here for your tranny vin to see which you have and other tranny info http://sun.science.wayne.edu/~jwaleke/trans/

vin plate looks like this Image

prices:
prices vary on lots of things. if you have the option get a donor car and sell everything left over. other wise look on the forsale boards or local or internet salvage yards
for me the prices were
$250 for the shifter,brackets,passenger axle, and all the other misc items
$300-350(I don't remember) for my 3.94 tranny
$30 average for a new throw out bearing
$30 roughly for mopar MTX tranny fluid (really recommend only mopar fluid)
$280 (i think) for the LUK modular clutch (clutches vary in price quite a bit)

optional upgrades:
$100 used afx street since you have to replace the ecu
$200 mopar short throw shifter
$25 jeff ball's booger bushings (definitely cool)click here for his site
$25-30 booger strut (highly recommended)click for mount

parts you'll need
Transmission
(1) Vehicle speed sensor appropriate for your year (rear of tranny)

(1) Left transaxle mount, AKA engine mount (in strut tower area on drivers side)

(1) Shifter cable bracket

(1) Bobble strut, upper mounting bracket, and bushing

(1) Clutch (recommend a new clutch) a modular clutch is easier

1 new throw out bearing

(1) PASSENGER SIDE axle (The long one) Make sure if you have ABS you get a ABS axle if you don't have ABS either will work fine.

(1) entire clutch/brake pedal assembly. including any switches or sensors

1 clutch pedal stop (grey plastic thing) at the end of the cable attached to the pedal

(1) Shifter assembly (with knob and boot)

(1) Shifter linkage cables

(1) Clutch pedal position switch

(1) Clutch cable

(2) Shift cable retaining clips

(2) Shift cable retaining clips (for the other end)

(1) The longer of the two engine to transmission brackets

(1) K member from a MTX neon. recommended over welding a bracket on the auto kmeber(its easier)

(1) Plug for the reverse light switch on the tranny with the pigtail of wiring (front of tranny)

(1) Bobble strut (recommend aftermarket hard bobble strut)

1 computer from a manual car for your year car..aka ecm, pcm, ecu
car will work with the auto but the rev limit will be pretty low @ 55k or so and you will have the check engine light

2.5 quarts of tranny fluid (that's 2 and a half bottles only use mopar fluid)

new cotter pins

high pressure high temp grease

some extra wire for the reverse light plug. and the clutch pedal switch

buttconectors



tools you may need
1) Sockets (in mm): 8, 10, 13, 15, 17, 18, 19, 21, 32 (hub nut socket)
2) Breaker bars
3) Pry bars (I suggest one long one, one midsize one)
4) Hydraulic Jacks ( I suggest 2)
5) 2 jack stands
6) Screwdriver assortment
7) Ratchets: 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 drive
8 ) Torque wrench
also a hayes or factory service manual will help a lot
lots and lots of extensions for the socket wrench..short ones and long ones

wire cutter/strippers

locktite or similar product

also wouldn't hurt to have some liquid wrench or WD-40
i definitely recommend a breaker bar if you don't have air tools
my big as red 3 foot crowbar (named tina don't ask) is what i used to get the clutch cable on

lots of plastic baggies and a sharpie for the misc bolts..(makes life a lot easier when they are separately labeled)


some tips and stuff some of which are from others that helped me out

be prepared to make trips back and forth to the parts store..you'll likely break or lose something or you my want to replace old parts..

while you have everything apart now would be a good time to check if you want to replace brakes,rotors,suspension bushings..
the rear main seal while the trans is out, you will be sorry if you don't

also if you have the funds why not replace stock parts with better parts?
i got a LUK modular clutch,mopar shifter,booger bushings and booger strut, and an afx ecu. also you can put on a fresh set of rotors and better brake pads if needed..or since you have the suspension apart put in new rubber bushings or prothane/energy suspension bushings..also you could put filled motor mounts now too

the pedal assembly seems to be a pain but once you figure out how to get around the steering column its not to bad.after you unbolt it, it will be glued to the plastic/rubber..just pry it loose,,you might want to pull the brake booster a little out from the engine side..it makes things a lot easier..also remove the drivers seat to give you some room

the flexplate is keyed to the flywheel so make sure you have it on correctly (the bolts are keyed in a certain order)

put the clutch/flywheel into the tranny before you put the tranny into place (don't forget to have the throw out bearing on there(lubed of course)

when putting the clutch cable on you will want to use a crowbar to push the clutch lever (inside the tranny) so that the cable will be long enough to go onto the clutch pedal(this part sucked)

take off the flexplate and make marks on the flexplate to the flywheel to how it should go into place... use a sharpie... make a mark on the flywheel and flexplate
put the tranny into place and get under the car, have someone turn the crank (by the crank pulley) until your marks line up and bolt them into place by turning the crank to turn the flexplate/flywheel

NOTE: i didn't do it this way and i had to keep moving the crank till i had the right lineup



clutch pedal wires (directly copied) this is not needed but the car will start in gear if you don't wire this. in my opinion do the wires last

The clutch safety switch has a solid yellow wire and a yellow wire with a red stripe on it. Locate the larger gauge solid yellow wire under your dash in the wire loom. Cut that wire... The solid yellow wire that comes outta the safety switch will be connected to the solid yellow wire (larger gauge) that you had just cut (the end that seems like is coming from the fuse box). The yellow wire with the red stripe will be connected to the other end of that solid yellow wire (larger gauge) which leads through the fire wall.

All the wiring consists of.... clutch safety switch, reverse lights switch (which are patched into the outside wires on the neutral safety switch), and the center wire on the neutral safety switch needs to be grounded.

When you locate that thick gauge solid yellow wire, you will have to cut it in the center (where both ends are about the same length) there is not a lot of wire there to play with. You have about a 4 inch length there to work with, 2 inches after you cut it. The side that I referred to as the fuse box, is the side that is NOT actually going through the firewall (speaking after you cut the wire)." - author unknown


or the more simple way....there should be a yellow wire in the main harness that goes from somewhere in the steering column, out that giant leaf spring juice rubber plug thing that all the wires go though.... you have to cut it. and wire one side to each terminal on the clutch pedal connector

reverse light plug in engine bay on front side of tranny

the connector with two wires on it is useless. just zip-tie it up somewhere......

the connector with 3 wires. needs to be cut off on the plug end

you need just the wires... cuz you need to splice those wires into the MTX reverse light plug

the two purple wires go together... then the white wire goes to i believe the yellow wire on the car harness,. and the brown wire gets grounded to the frame

(in my case it was purple-purple, white-white and yellow/with brown stripe gets grounded)

In my opinion the swap was well worth it and wasn't that hard at all just make sure you have at least 2 people. and if you don't have air tools definitely get breaker bars there will be some tight leaf spring juice bolts.
the car is faster more fun and pulls so much harder. if you do it you'll love it.

_________________
Image
14.3@96.08 sohc all motor stock bottom end,stock intake mani & head
http://www.FloridaNeons.org


Last edited by Spoo76 on Thu Jun 13, 2002 9:17 pm, edited 4 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2002 2:59 pm 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast

Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2002 12:15 pm
Posts: 3469
Location: NC
To use the automatic's computer with the swap you just have to do this.
Before you remove the auto tranny from the car and while you are draining it remove the pan.
Remove the manual valve body. http://ripcuda.50megs.com/shift.html
Take off the torque converter lockup solenoid connected to the vavle body.
Zip tie it to the wires by the side of the computer and plug it in.
Put back in the valve body and pan.

When you do the swap you may/should changed the spring on the throttle body.
The spring on the 49mm (aka 5 speed throttle body) is stiffer allowing you to control the pedal better. IE you don't get a mushy pedal.
Take off the stock throttle body. http://neons.org/howtos/TB.shtml
Remove the TPS sensor using a T20 torx bit. Be CAREFUL not to strip or break the screws.
Use the T20 bit to remove the butterfly screws. Slide out the butterfly.
If this is your first time handling a throttle body take a good look at how the spring is on the throttle body.
Push in the throttle body cam toward the sensor hole.
There will be a C-clip. Remove it too.
Slide out the throttle body cam.
Put the spring from the 5 speed throttle body on.
Installation is the reverse of removal.
*My SOHC plastic intake manifold has a rubber 0 ring for a gasket. Those with aluminum intake manifolds may need a gasket*

Removing the fans and radiator give you more room to work with, remove them. If you want to remove the a/c and power steering now is a good time too. *It is illegal to vent your a/c into the atmosphere, take it to a shop who can remove it for you*
Changing your coolant now would be a good thing. Just remember to fill it back up. ;)

I highly recommend using a 'tranny' jack. I used a hydrolic floor jack/car jack with a dartboard to get the manual tranny up there. It sucked. Bad. This is the ONLY thing I didn't do by myself.

After you remove the fmm to get to the lower starter bolts I suggest re-attaching it to the frame/engine. Do this in addition to placing a jack and a wood block under your oil pan. Extra protection never hurts.

I also suggest refilling the trans threw the speeds sensor hole.

About the sharpie and plastic baggies...
DO IT. And keep them in the order you took them off. This may sound like no big deal but it will help if you don't know your bolts.

Doing the pedals sucked x2 since I had to remove them from my donor car and install them. Definatly pull out the brake booster to make life easy.

Personaly I had no trouble moving the fork inside the tranny to get the clutch cable on. :)

And best of all enjoy working with rusty bolts!
I used a Haynes for this. Read it till you understand everything.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2004 7:18 pm 
Offline
Site Supporter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 6:50 am
Posts: 479
For a 2nd Gen, I think the Rage ATX-->MTX kit is a waste. Maybe I'm just misinformed because I didn't buy the kit myself, but I called and asked where they got their parts from, and the guy said from 1st gens. Well, if that's the case, the shifter from the 1st gen won't work in the 2nd gen car. Also, the right(passenger) half-shaft that needs to be replaced with the swap needs to come from a 2nd gen. A first gen right half-shaft will "fit" but the last end, (I don't know what it's called) the little part that goes into the knuckle and is after the CV joint (that part) will have to be replaced with one from a 2nd gen. I hope I wasn't too wordy, but that's the best I can explain it. Basically, a 1st gen right half-shaft end that sticks into the knuckle is too small for a 2nd gen knuckle. Also, the clutch/brake pedal assembly from a 1st gen will not fit into a 2nd gen without major cutting of the pedal assembly, and cutting the interior metal (behind the steering column) of the car. Even then, the brake pedal will be so far back, you'll have to search for it to press it. Kinda unsafe I think. Having done this swap myself, here are the parts I needed for my 2000 ES:

Cable tranny from 1st gen (gearing doesn't matter. It's your preference)
Clutch cable from 1st gen
Right(passenger) Half-shaft from 2nd gen
Clutch/Brake pedal assembly w/ sensors from 2nd gen (***WARNING*** 2000 and 2001 only for cable trannies)
Tranny "motor" mount
Shifting cables and brackets from 1st gen
All tranny sensors and brackets(except bobble strut bracket) from 1st gen tranny
Shifter assembly from 2nd gen or SRT4
Boot from 2nd gen or SRT (knob depends on shifter)
Clutch and trow-out bearing (stock 1st gen clutch wouldn't do me any good. I'd burn it up in a week)

Everything is pretty much the same as the 1st gen swap, but there is no need for a bobble strut, k-member, or bobble strut braket for the 2nd gen. What I added is what gen vehicles you need to get your parts from to save you a little time. Of course, if you take EVERYTHING from the same model year 2nd gen, it will work, but it will also cost you more because of part availability for the 2nd gen.

Off the top of my head, I think that's it.
Feel free to PM me for further questions.
--Vic


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 11:31 am 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2002 12:28 pm
Posts: 536
Location: Jupiter florida Where old people run you off the road
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp

i had one back in the MTX for a while while the stand alone was being wired and it was HORRIBLE
having it cut fuel and spark at 6k... imagine trying to pass a car and you feel the car jerk because the motor stops?

_________________
Image
14.3@96.08 sohc all motor stock bottom end,stock intake mani & head
http://www.FloridaNeons.org


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 3:34 pm 
Offline
Site Supporter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 6:50 am
Posts: 479
spoo76 wrote:
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp


That's what happens when you start your build for an ATX and buy an AF/X ATX Race unit and a little after you receive it, you decide to go MTX. :roll:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 4:07 pm 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2002 12:28 pm
Posts: 536
Location: Jupiter florida Where old people run you off the road
2KNightRiderES wrote:
spoo76 wrote:
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp


That's what happens when you start your build for an ATX and buy an AF/X ATX Race unit and a little after you receive it, you decide to go MTX. :roll:


but does the AFX ATX have a higher limit?
stock ATX doesnt even have a rev limit.. it just cuts off at 6k lol

_________________
Image
14.3@96.08 sohc all motor stock bottom end,stock intake mani & head
http://www.FloridaNeons.org


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 10:12 pm 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast

Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2002 12:15 pm
Posts: 3469
Location: NC
spoo76 wrote:
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp

i had one back in the MTX for a while while the stand alone was being wired and it was HORRIBLE
having it cut fuel and spark at 6k... imagine trying to pass a car and you feel the car jerk because the motor stops?

It is not a waste of time. The atx computer is just like the mtx one except it looks for the torque converter solenoid, which can be kept.
You still get the 6750 redline with the sohc computer, and you don't have to buy a mtx one which can save you money.

I hope you see why an atx computer could be used now? If not PM me?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 10:18 pm 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2002 12:28 pm
Posts: 536
Location: Jupiter florida Where old people run you off the road
fusion210 wrote:
spoo76 wrote:
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp

i had one back in the MTX for a while while the stand alone was being wired and it was HORRIBLE
having it cut fuel and spark at 6k... imagine trying to pass a car and you feel the car jerk because the motor stops?

It is not a waste of time. The atx computer is just like the mtx one except it looks for the torque converter solenoid, which can be kept.
You still get the 6750 redline with the sohc computer, and you don't have to buy a mtx one which can save you money.

I hope you see why an atx computer could be used now? If not PM me?


im talking stock... stock is not worth it

_________________
Image
14.3@96.08 sohc all motor stock bottom end,stock intake mani & head
http://www.FloridaNeons.org


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2004 11:24 pm 
Offline
New

Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2003 5:02 am
Posts: 1
Location: Wichita, Ks
Well I wish someone would tell me how to install the damn MTX ECU I wasted $125 on......I got it in after checking part numbers for a week, and getting a 2001 MTX owner to give me his PN off his ECU....still doesn't work.

_________________
www.XtremeNeons.com

2001 ES MTX
3.94 swap
Magnum Swap
Custom CAI
Crane #14 Cam
Crane Cam gear
Kirk Longtube header
LiveWire plug wires
"Noname" UDP
SAFCII
IN Work: Turbo setup


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 12:08 am 
Offline
Neon Enthusiast

Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2002 12:15 pm
Posts: 3469
Location: NC
spoo76 wrote:
fusion210 wrote:
spoo76 wrote:
i still dont see why anyone would waste time using an ATX comp

i had one back in the MTX for a while while the stand alone was being wired and it was HORRIBLE
having it cut fuel and spark at 6k... imagine trying to pass a car and you feel the car jerk because the motor stops?

It is not a waste of time. The atx computer is just like the mtx one except it looks for the torque converter solenoid, which can be kept.
You still get the 6750 redline with the sohc computer, and you don't have to buy a mtx one which can save you money.

I hope you see why an atx computer could be used now? If not PM me?


im talking stock... stock is not worth it

Free use of atx pcm vs $25-50 on a 5 speed one...


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Style based on FI Subice by phpBBservice.nl